Path: sn.no!uninett.no!newsfeed.nacamar.de!wuff.mayn.de!Cabal.CESspool!bofh.vszbr.cz!news1.mpcs.com!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news From: fjc@thingy.apana.org.au (Frank Copeland) Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology,comp.org.eff.talk,alt.censorship Subject: Re: Internet Ventures, Inc. (Response) Date: 25 Oct 1997 22:44:01 +1000 Organization: Australian Public Access Network Association Lines: 75 Message-ID: References: <344cca1d.8671929@news.supernews.com> <344f85c8.61309398@news.calstate.edu> <34513C75.312B433B@tidepool.com> Old-NNTP-Posting-Host: thingy.apana.org.au X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Mail-To-News-Contact: postmaster@nym.alias.net Xref: sn.no alt.religion.scientology:387648 comp.org.eff.talk:73772 alt.censorship:171223 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Donald Janke wrote: [A lot of sanctimonious drivel deleted] You really don't get it, do you? It's not Grady that's on trial here. Grady doesn't need you to unfreeze his account so that he can take part in some internet kangaroo court. He already has other access arrangements in place, and since I doubt he is interested in putting any more money in your pockets unfreezing his account will simply allow him to ease the transition to another provider with some balls and a bit of backbone. All he needs from you is for you to keep your side of the bargain you entered into when you took his money. I see this 'court' you are trying to set up here is a disgusting attempt to deflect attention away from yourself and blame Grady for *your* mistakes. I find such cowardice much more vile than anything Grady has ever written. I've read your AUP (not the one you hurriedly slapped together after the event to justify your panic-stricken actions, but the one in force at the time Grady was canned) and not only was there nothing in it forbidding the kind of protected free speech Grady was engaging in, but there was a positive statement to the effect that you would not interfere in the freedom of expression of your customers. Your moralising about the limits of free speech is nothing more than a pathetic piece of arse-covering. You claim that a company has to set limits on how it will do business; as far as I am concerned you had already done so, and the limits you set were well beyond the ones you are now seeking to enforce on Grady. It's clear to me from your justifications that you are motivated by fear of litigation. First of all it was fear of being sued by $cientology. Now you are furiously backpeddling out of fear of being sued by Grady. You'll get no sympathy from me for your plight, for you've brought it on yourself. No-one with the brains [insert deity of choice] gave a sparrow would have taken wgert@loop.com's unsubstantiated allegations of libel at face value. Simple common sense should have prompted a question or two. Who was being libelled? What business was it of wgert's? Why did they not take it up with Grady directly? Why should it be any concern of yours? It would have been nothing more than common decency to contact Grady and ask him for his side of the story. All this could have been avoided if you had opted for a bit of dialogue in the first place. Imagine anyone in any other line of business pulling the plug on a long-standing customer on the unsupported word of a complete stranger. What fun your competitors could have. And I bet they are all pissing themselves right now. Stop this pathetic attempt to justify yourself. You are simply making things worse by trying to put Grady on trial. Face up to reality: you've been conned. wgert managed to put one over you, but it's all been for nothing. Grady hasn't been silenced, merely enraged along with a lot of other people. The big loser in all of this is you: you've lost a good customer and put money into the pockets of a competitor. You've made yourself a laughing stock, and a public disgrace. If you have any sense, or decency, you'll apologise to Grady and negotiate a settlement with him. If you don't, I hope he takes you to the cleaners. - -- Home Page: Not the Scientology Home Page: Keep it in Usenet. E-mail replies and 'courtesy' copies are not welcome. If you're selling, I ain't buying. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBNFHoeoBOXdsElwbdAQFQ7AP+I0zPQ1oV+mAENC9Eh5pKOzCWPzUaGNNJ PDI3iO8r0ZwdvM29dUkVWolYhxLUH9zGssD1PElYxUG29loJbkZpsK7hqHat3Zep mPkVWp5mcXa+rgccDQVyg5lCAbrED8sfptEGdSqoMpYP+Hgn1f68zHEF2v1ZRoKM zKpomnTCx18= =ho6j -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----